Best place to get live rock and live sand

[TheDingy]

I am looking for someplace to get around 400lbs of live rock and 200lbs to 400lbs of live sand to go with it. I don’t have a problem going pretty much anyplace in California, Vegas, Phoenix but don’t want to pay 13/lb which is what some of the prices I have seen around here. Looking for suggestions.

[Michael Hoaster]

I like Gulfliverock.com. It's farmed live rock, so it's sustainable. Standard shipping is included in the price. They have live sand as well.

[BayReefer1232]

For wet live rock I'd try saltybottomreefcompany. It's $5/lb

[Timfish]

I also have been happy with GulfLiveROck.com. Besides Saltybottomreefcompany there's also TampaBay. It should be cheaper getting it shipped air frieght and picking it up at an airport than having it shipped to your door. Also keep in mind if you're not already aware but it will need to be quarintined for a month to deal with any dieoff.

[TheDingy]

Originally Posted by Timfish

Also keep in mind if you're not already aware but it will need to be quarintined for a month to deal with any dieoff.

This is a brand new build, 550 gallons total in the system, I am very aware of how to cycle the tank .

[TheDingy]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

I like Gulfliverock.com. It's farmed live rock, so it's sustainable. Standard shipping is included in the price. They have live sand as well.

One thing that really ****es me off is that people that are in the know, know the “sustainable” statement there is pretty much B.S. as in 1990 Florida banned rock harvested from state waters. I would prefer Fiji rock myself, even if someone with in an up to 10-12 hour drive that is breaking down a tank I would buy everything from them.

I posted this question on Facebook as well, to a couple of local reef aquariums groups. I got so many DMs from store owners or their spouses etc none of which I was asking for.

I will say this, I bought live rock many years ago that was the farmed rock and it just didn’t seem to perform as well. This may have changed in the last 12 years, but I don’t know.

[Michael Hoaster]

First time I've had a comment called out as BS. Would you care to explain?

[Timfish]

Originally Posted by TheDingy

This is a brand new build, 550 gallons total in the system, I am very aware of how to cycle the tank .

I wasn't referring to cycling your tank. Quarantining live rock, like anything else that goes in a reef system, is the best way to ensure any dieoff has occured and the biology has adjusted and is doing well. Marucultured live rock might also have mantis shrimp (cool animals but something best kept in a sump or species tank) and quarantining rock gives you an opportunity to find them and keep them from being introduced although I've never found one on live rock from Gulf Live ROck.

I also don't understand your response to Micheal Hoester's comment about sustanability.

As far as maricultured rock performance if anything I see less dieoff than with wild collected live rock from FLorida back when it was available. Working in a LFS back in the 90's wild FLorida live rock was stunning with all the featherdusters than made calcium tubes but seeing how they quickly died off it seemed a waste. Now that we have a better understanding of the critical role of cryptic sponges in recycling the labiel DOC that has the potential of causing probelms with corals maricultured lieve rock seems to me to be an excellent and the best sustainable source for them.

For more on DOC and sponges I would recommend Forest ROhwer's "Coral Reefs in the Microbial Seas" (kindle ~$10, paperback ~$20) and Jasper de Goeij's thesis work here (the intro is in Dutch and the rest is in English).

These videos are good introductions to microbial processes on reefs:

Forest Rohwer "Coral Reefs in the Microbial Seas"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-R2BMEfQGjU

"Changing Seas"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7hsp0dENEA

[TheDingy]

Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster

First time I've had a comment called out as BS. Would you care to explain?

Because you can not harvest wild live rock anyplace in Florida, because it hasn’t been allowed since 1990. IIRC. Anyone selling Florida live rock is either stealing from the state or doing farming and is “sustainable”. It is like the electric cars and solar systems are so “sustainable” but what about all the harmful chemicals etc that are produced with the process of producing them.

Our tank that was in our home in South Florida was stocked with all very nice live rock that was wild harvested. It was amazing, this was in the 80’s and 90’s. Also the last time that I built out anything more than a 20 gallon etc it was with Fiji live rock that had some amazing life on it. The last decent sized system I had was 1500 gallons total with a pair of 500 gallon cube display tanks.

TimFish: Once the system is established yes I will check anything out and deal with die off at that time. I haven’t taken a month in the past, I know a lot of people do, but I am usually once live rock is in I don’t change it out. I also have a process that I use for new corals fish etc.

The one thing that I have seen that has killed the South Florida reefs than everything else combines is the darned Lion Fish that comes directly from a lot of people in our hobby. It is just like on my property finding Iguanas and non native snake species.