Reef Central Online Community

Home Forum Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences View New Posts View Today's Posts

Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Search Reefkeeping ...an online magazine for marine aquarists Support our sponsors and mention Reef Central

Go Back   Reef Central Online Community > Invert and Plant Forums > Mantis Shrimp
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

User Tag List

Reply
Thread Tools
Old 01/17/2008, 12:40 AM   #1
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
Looking for a mantis tank

I'm new to this forum, but have been on livingreefs for a while now. No one over there is really commenting on the mantis tank in the last few days, so I thought I would give it a shot here. Right now my mantis is in a 4.5 gallon tank with like 1/8" or less thick glass. maybe 1/16" even. Its very thin. I'm worried about my mantis breaking the glass, and I want to upgrade to a bigger tank. I live close to fosters and smith and want to take a trip up there tomorrow on my day off and get a new tank. I was thinking acrylic so it would withstand hits. I cant think of the type of mantis I have again, the store called it an "orange mantis" but its not, it was like a rainbow or something I think. Here is a picture
Its a spear type, but when it hits the glass it really sounds like it could break. I was going to get the eclipse 12 on sale at fosters and smith, but its on backorder and I want to do this tomorrow. Next option is a 12 gallon nano cube for $119.99. How thick is the glass? Do you think a slasher mantis will be a problem? How is the filtration on those?
What do you guys think?
Should I keep the cheap crushed coral in there? will that be ok for burrowing? or do I need some sand? Could I just cut a piece of PVC? And If so what size diameter? My mantis is about 3-4" long. Sorry for so many questions, and thanks in advance for any help!


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/17/2008, 02:02 AM   #2
justinl
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,118
okay, well first off, a P. ciliata (which is what you have) cannot break glass. that isnt your problem.

crushed coral as a substrate isnt the best, aragonite is best imo.

I assume you have live rock and for it to use for a burrow? If not then that would explain a bit about the mantis' condition (which is you main problem). are the black spots along its back just debris or are they actually in the mantis' carapace? this could be shell disease. see those little tufts of green along its back? If that's algae that is growing off the mantis, then there's a big problem. You need to black out that tank, feed enriched food every day, and keep pristine water quality while not even looking at the mantis until it (hopefully) molts. otherwise it's a goner. let it go too far and the algae rhizomes (algal root structure) will penetrate the carapace and not allow the animal to molt. this will kill it.


justinl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/17/2008, 04:33 AM   #3
Pea-brain
Moved On
 
Pea-brain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Vassalboro, ME
Posts: 1,661
To add to what justin said this mantis shouldn't be on cc because it is so rough and will wear on the shell of the mantis.

It should be in at least a 12 gallon tank

A PVC burrow would be best, twice the length of the mantis or 3X, 1.5X the wodth and in a curved U shape. They can also burrow under rocks in sand substrates.

Dan


Pea-brain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/17/2008, 09:53 AM   #4
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
Thanks for the replies. That picture was from the day I got my mantis at a fish store in Madison where it sat for 3 years. Since then that algae has disappeared from its back. Its good to hear that this species cant break glass. Maybe I'll go with the 12g cube then and pick up a bag of argonite at fosters and smith today If the roads arent too bad. Anything else you guys can suggest right away to a new mantis enthusiast?


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/17/2008, 12:18 PM   #5
DanInSD
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,255
I'd be much more worried about that algae growing on the shell!

Dan


DanInSD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/17/2008, 08:08 PM   #6
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
As stated, the algae disappeared within days after getting the mantis. I'm thinking about getting the 12 gallon nano cube :
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...7&pcatid=10677
My mantis should be ok in this tank correct? I really wanted to set something up and share a sump with my main display tank. But I think I would only do that if I got an acrylic tank and drilled the back for a simple overflow and return... Will the filtration be adequate on a nano cube do you guys think?


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/17/2008, 10:19 PM   #7
justinl
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,118
*sigh of relief* good to hear you got the mantis over the algae. how about a new pic? I love seeing the bright yellow P. ciliata morph.

yeah, that 12 should be fine. keep in mind that the mantis alone will be all the bioload you can put in that tank though. they are messy eaters. Just in case you'e interested, a mantis reef is possible (Ive done it with my G. smithii), but you will have to keep a very close eye on water quality.


justinl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/17/2008, 10:29 PM   #8
Feclar
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 170
Quote:
Originally posted by hotimportknight
As stated, the algae disappeared within days after getting the mantis. I'm thinking about getting the 12 gallon nano cube :
http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...7&pcatid=10677
My mantis should be ok in this tank correct? I really wanted to set something up and share a sump with my main display tank. But I think I would only do that if I got an acrylic tank and drilled the back for a simple overflow and return... Will the filtration be adequate on a nano cube do you guys think?
The glass nano cube should work out well, this guy will not break glass.

The acrylic sump would also be very nice as long as it is 10g or more, this species likes to roam during the day.

Guess it depends on what would look best aesthetically in your house, a sump or a nano cube? I bet you will be checking out the mantis tank quite often.

Either create some nice caves with your LR or get a nice U shaped PVC tube, lay down your substrate then put your liverock on top of the PVC and you should be golden

p.s. I doubt fish will last long with this guy, but will be able to sustain an invert cleanup crew



Last edited by Feclar; 01/17/2008 at 10:34 PM.
Feclar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/18/2008, 12:11 AM   #9
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
You think I can actually have a nassarius or something in there for cleanup? I was going to throw in a blue devil damsel once my friend gets it out of his tank. So far the mantis hasnt killed any feeder fish I threw in... Kinda disappointed about that. The idea I had was building an acrylic tank and drilling 2 holes, one to overflow as it fills and 1 return, both at the top. But the acrylic alone was 60$ + other stuff like weldon 4 and bulkheads and lights and so on... fosters and smith was 60 some bucks with lights and filter and hoods and stuff. its on sale right now from around 90$ I think, But then I saw the nano cube and thought that it looked like a nice clean design that would be way simpler than rigging an overflow and a return from my sump. They even have free stands with some of them right now. So I think im going to go with that route.
When you guys say get a U shaped PVC pipe, do you mean a pcv pipe cut in half? Or an actual curved piece of PVC?


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/18/2008, 01:11 AM   #10
Feclar
Premium Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 170
It may not eat till it feels secure with its burrow.


__________________
"Do the right thing... win or lose."
-Emiliana Torrini

Current Tank Info: 12g Aquapod (stock)
Feclar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/18/2008, 03:42 AM   #11
justinl
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,118
snails and hermits should be okay. should. some mantids can manage to actually pull an unfortunate snail or hermit out of the shell without having to crack the shell. I dont think they do this often though, especially if they are well fed. note that crabs are toast with a spearer because they have a vulnerable soft belly.

FW feeder fish you mean? dont feed those too often. they're probably not very nutritional. If a mantis is offered a dead easy meal vs. a live struggling fish that needs to be hunted down, it will go for the easy meal. starve the mantis for a few days then throw the fish in. odds are it will be hungry enough by then.


justinl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/18/2008, 07:24 AM   #12
gholland
Registered Member
 
gholland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 238
If you go with one of the "cube" type aquariums, you may want to do a quick mod to provide better surface skimming than the stock arrangement does. It's not that big of a deal though. I personally like them.

Quote:
Originally posted by hotimportknight
When you guys say get a U shaped PVC pipe, do you mean a pcv pipe cut in half? Or an actual curved piece of PVC?
An actual curved piece of PVC.


gholland is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/18/2008, 11:55 AM   #13
justinl
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,118
theres a few things to be done to the AOI "plug and play" aquariums to really make them marine aquarium worthy. Just search around for what mods can/should be done to your specific one. I have a oceanic biocube that i modded a little bit.


justinl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/21/2008, 07:48 PM   #14
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
I got the 12 gallon nano cube today, and get it home and its larger than I expected, I could have gotten a free stand with the premium model, but decided I didnt have room. It wont fit on my desk where I was planning because the top has to lift up and backwards to get at the filter and all that stuff in the back... I have an audio tower, but I have NO idea if it will support around 100 lbs in the middle of the top... I searched online and couldnt find any info, has anyone ever tried putting a 12g cube on a tempered glass audio tower? Its basically the same thing as this, just slightly different colors. the glass is tempered 1/4" glass, my concern is that its only supported in the 4 corners. What do you guys think?

http://www.kohls.com/kohlsStore/furn...udio+Tower.jsp


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/21/2008, 09:30 PM   #15
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
Anyone? Im anxious to get setting this up and don't really have many options for placement. Does anyone know if 1/4" tempered glass supported in 4 corners will hold a 12g nano cube filled? I can put my weight on it (130 lbs only) but thats short bursts of weight, not a long term pressure...


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/21/2008, 10:14 PM   #16
justinl
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,118
personally i wouldnt risk it... 1/4" isnt very thick.


justinl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/21/2008, 10:40 PM   #17
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
Thats what im kind of thinking, not sure what the options are now, but I'm bored want to get this mantis in a real tank ASAP. I guess it would be a good idea to not have 12 gallons of saltwater over my sony XBR tv, HD DVR box, surround sound, and my klipsch subs... I'm at a loss for finding a place for my new mantis home now... My room is very small until I transfer to a new school after this semester is done. Tomorrow I may try bracing the glass audio tower and trying that.


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/22/2008, 11:24 PM   #18
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
I decided to reinforce the top of my audio tower with 2 pieces of wood along the middle. I jumped up and sat on top of it, so its plenty strong. I got the water in, used my old water in addition to new saltwater. I need more live rock now that ive got a bigger tank, hopefully tomorrow i'll get to the LFS before work. Here it is so far, 12 gallon nano cube, used the ceramic rings, 5 bio balls, carbon and filter sponge in the back that came with it, Never used anything like this before but it seems to be a good system. Here are a few pics so far. Not sure why, but the mantis hasnt went near the PVC yet... Let me know what you guys think.




The tank looks so blue under the new lights in pictures. Its not actually that bright in person, but it should turn more white when the lights break in. Let me know what you guys think, give a few ideas perhaps? Thanks!


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/23/2008, 07:30 AM   #19
gholland
Registered Member
 
gholland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 238
You might consider smaller diameter pvc or provide some small rubble the ciliata can use to close the entrances up a bit.


gholland is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/23/2008, 10:09 AM   #20
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
Alright, thanks for the suggestion. I'm going to go to the LFS in a few minutes, ill try to pick up some rubble. Someone said that this species should be able to be housed with a cleaning crew, what should be safe? I got some cheap hermits at fosters and smith on sale the other day, should I try one of them? Or some sort of snails? Basically could I add any inverts other than coral to the tank? I'm going to wait on the coral until the mantis gets the rocks situated how he wants.


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/23/2008, 11:12 AM   #21
Simran
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Monterey, California
Posts: 65
I would have let that tank cycle for atleast a month before putting my mantis inside it...


__________________
Satsimran

Current Tank Info: 75 gallon bow front reef with 40 gallon sump
Simran is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/23/2008, 12:55 PM   #22
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
Its all substrate and rock from old tanks. 5/12 the water was old tank water as well. I don't think there will be any sort of die off at all. The live rock I picked up today was cured for a min of 2 months in a cow tank at the LFS.


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/23/2008, 01:37 PM   #23
Pea-brain
Moved On
 
Pea-brain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Vassalboro, ME
Posts: 1,661
Snails and hermits will be fine, shrimp will be food, crabs will probly be food, serpent starfish will most likely be left alone, urchins will probly be fine.

Dan


Pea-brain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/23/2008, 02:06 PM   #24
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
Thanks for the tip, a cleanup crew would be a nice thing to have! I got some rock and as many rubble pieces as the LFS had today, I kinda like the aqua scaping hopefully the mantis does and doesnt topple the nice rocks over and just plays with the 13 rubble pieces i scattered around the entrance to the burrow. Tried feeding him/her already but she grabbed it and started burying it, so after she turned her back I pulled it out and threw it in my DT. A Few more pic updates!:




hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/23/2008, 02:08 PM   #25
hotimportknight
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Marshfield, Wi
Posts: 34
The reason for the fancy "dangerous" aqua-scaping is i'm hoping to get a blue devil out of my friends tank he wants gone, i'm going to test if the mantis will take to fish tank mates or if it will kill them.


hotimportknight is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:27 PM.


TapaTalk Enabled

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2021 Axivo Inc.
Use of this web site is subject to the terms and conditions described in the user agreement.
Reef CentralTM Reef Central, LLC. Copyright 1999-2014
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2021 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.